Updated: Sun Feb. 15 2009 15:09:04

ctvbc.ca

A Langley family is angry they're out a car and thousands of dollars in insurance after the Insurance Corporation of B.C. sold their car without their consent.

Brendan Lillies, 19, wanted to fix his 1992 Acura Integra after it was rear-ended -- but ICBC sold the car for scrap, and despite a four-month protracted dispute, still hasn't settled with the family.

"[A reasonable person] would go to the police and report the car stolen," said Brendan's dad, Charlie Lillies.

After being contacted by CTV News, ICBC apologized to the family.

"In this case we made an error," said ICBC's Adam Grossman. "We acknowledge it and we're doing everything we can to make that up with the customer."

In the accident, Brendan was hit from behind and then pushed into a car in front of him. The at-fault driver fled -- and ICBC assigned fault to Brendan.

ICBC said they would pay $2,700 for the car, even though only days before Brendan had put in a new engine, rims and tires worth more than $3,000. That, combined with the value of the car itself, should total more than $6,000, said the Lillies.

That's when Brendan's dad Charlie decided the family would pay out the claim and just fix the car themselves.

"We asked for the vehicle back, and they said, 'Sorry, the vehicle's been sold. You can't get the car back,'" said Charlie.

Even though they didn't sign a salvage waiver -- the paperwork that transfers the ownership from Brendan to ICBC -- ICBC had already sold the car.

That was months ago -- but ICBC kept charging Brendan for his insurance premiums. When Brendan tried to get a refund for the premiums, his dad says a clerk demanded that he sign the salvage waiver after the fact.

"It's just a lesson," said Charlie. "Do your homework before you make a claim -- they're not going to do it for you. They'll take advantage of someone who's just a young guy."

When ICBC writes off a car they sell it to a salvage yard, who sell it for parts. The Lillies tracked down the Acura to a salvage lot in Surrey, where they found its engine had been stripped, its rims and tires were gone, and there wasn't much left.

"I'm a bit angry about it," said Brendan. "It's not like I can walk across the street to my neighbour's house, grab his keys, throw his truck on Craigslist and sell it."

ICBC has made another offer on the car, which is about $4,000, said Grossman. If an independent arbitrator decides the car is worth more, then the company will pay more, he said.

Grossman said he couldn't find any other example of a car being sold for scrap without authorization.

"It's extremely rare," he said. "We are making up with an offer that's more than fair."

With a report from CTV British Columbia's Jon Woodward

Comments are now closed for this story

Harold
Not at all surprising - despite answering to the Crown, they are, after all, nothing more than an insurance company.

bugs bunny
i know the feeling,i had a honda accord they wrote off for me,and wanted to give me $850 for when the bluebook value was $2750,

HKP in Vancouver
OK...a 17 year old used car...and he wants $ 6000.00 for it...???? good luck !!!

Harry
Has ICBC pulled off antics like this for years?

Back in the early 90's, they told my father that his car was to be written off after another driver drove into his vehicle. He told them "no way" when they gave him an offer and demanded that he get his car back. They kept balking...finally, seeing that he wasn't going to leave the office without the keys, they told him that they had already sold his vehicle to a girl working in an ICBC office who had it repaired.

I wonder why so few people have come forward over the years...maybe people just feel stupid and figure they can't win against ICBC.

glenn man
yes, the same produre has been happening for years.....in 1992 my (3yr old) van was hit (by Impaired driver), a write off....so I DID NOT SIGN ANYTHING ! When very low offers from ICBC came, I waited.....after weeks of offers I got the price I wanted and before I got to the local ICBC rep in person, a friend called to say my van was towed from the scrap yard to a shop in Burnaby after the auction...(he followed it there). I got my cheque late on a Friday and signed away the van but then went to the autobody on Saturday.....Sure enough.....my van was sold Thursday to him!

Demetry Rokanas
The car had over 345,000kms on it and over $2000.00 prior damage and now has structural damage in the front and rear again. The car was auctioned as a dismantle only and sold for under $300.00 as it just didn't have any value. ICBC did the right thing to keep this piece of junk off the road for good. I did find it odd at the support for this young man, where are all the anti-street racing folks/media on this ?

Dave Simons, Prince George
ICBC did a similar thing to my daughter when she skidded on black ice and rolled her truck into the ditch. To make a long story short, she was threatened, coerced and treated like a criminal by ICBC. She was offed the black book price for her truck which was 40% below the retail value. She had to settle for this because she lives out of town and had to have a vehicle to get to work. All the while during the discussions with ICBC the agent kept referring to "helping" her and used the term "ICBC Assistance". What an oxymoron!! Lesson learned was beware of ICBC they ar NOT there to help you.

Marc
ICBC should pay what they are asking for + $2500 for the trouble. ICBC should also throw in some of their Olympic tickets as well.

Allie
Our insurance more then doubled when we moved here from Ontario last summer. We both have clear driving records.

Alan in Vancouver
It's long overdue to sell-off ICBC and get rid of this horrendous abuse that taxpayers and insureds suffer continuously at that hands of this taxpayer subsidized monopoly.

A competitive insurance program for BC is needed.

This monster monopoly was created by the Dave Barret gang of incompetents.

Time to dump it now, along with all the leaches!

BIG-Jim
Time to go back to private maybe?????????????

Send your sister to lay claims!
Sounds like ICBC. The way they asign fault is so horrid and random.
Ask anyone who has filed a claim in BC.
Heaven forfend if you are a single person of the male persuasion. Then you will get %100 fault without the blink of an eye.
ICBC is un-approachable. People just dont have time to take them on. You just give up, cause what the heck, you want to live your life.

Don
Yeah, uh...,ICBC? You better square this off without delay. There is a definite crossing of a line here, and you're hanging it out a little too far. Get on with it.

wayne--Nanaimo
ICBC should be charged under the criminal code.

Suzanne T (Lower Mainland)
ICBC was created by an NDP government partly because insurance firms at the time were imposing usury fees on customers. It was to protect the consumer, or so the spin went. However, ICBC has morphed into a gargantuan bureaucracy that is essentially public enemy number one. I have had more than one run in with ICBC. I would hope the Lillies will get themselves a lawyer.

Ryan in Victoria
Demetry Rokanas!!!
What part did you not understand ....
Even though they didn't sign a salvage waiver -- the paperwork that transfers the ownership from Brendan to ICBC -- ICBC had already sold the car.

Demetry Rokanas
People are missing the point here, sure ICBC should have done the paperwork correctly at the start and that's their fault. The key point here is this car was going to be written off in the end regardless of the out come in amount of payment. It had over 345,000 kms, over $2000.00 prior damage and now has extensive structural damage. ICBC has the authority to deem a vehicle non repairable regardless what the owner wants. As far as the value is concerned, just because the guy spends $3000.00 on an engine and tires, it doesn't make the car worth $3000.00 more. A car with 345,000 km's a blown engine and bald tires is worthless so asking ICBC for $6000 is out of order.

Zak Markham
Mr. Campbell, are you listening?

As Premier you are ultimately responsible for BC crown corporations.

You have overwhelming support to finally shed us of this NDP legacy of taxpayer abuse.

Dave
ICBC may act like any other private insurer during the claims process, but don't let the private insurers fool you - there is no way - I repeat no way private insurance is cheaper.

You can't even get coverage like ICBC offers in other provinces and states.

You think competition works? Just look at gas prices in BC!!!

Ara Hepburn
ICBC sure isn't perfect but I'd still rather them than private like I had out East. That was one horror story and rip off after another for everyone. Private insurance gouges even worse.
That said: ICBC towed my car after an accident (not my fault) to it's yard and when I went to get it, the car had been stripped: tires/rims, mahogany steering wheel, brake pads, everything possible. And they blamed me?!?

Shelley
Same thing happened to us...I would wager this is a common "mistake" they make. Getting it corrected is time consumming. Imagine if we all ran our Companies like they do! So, you have to wonder...how often does this occure? Without comment sections to online stories, how would ya know?

James B
How many people on hear want to consider both sides, or just take any opportunity to bash ICBC?

If you disagree with ICBC, also ask yourself this... would you pay more than $6,000 for a car that is 16-17 years old?

In addition, the story seems to say that ICBC has offered to have an independent valuation of this vehicle done, so it sounds like they are happy to pay fair value.

Should ICBC always pay what the customers requests or should they pay fair value?

wendyj
Considering He put a fair bit of money into the car before it was damaged, he obviously thought it was worth the time and money to fix up the car. My vehicle was written off 6 months ago, and I was told any work done in the 6 months or so previous to the accident would be considered to improve the final pay out. If they cannot return the vehicle, it's their problem to fix.

Ara Hepburn
I've had to live where there is private auto insurance and No Thanks. It make even ICBC look good.
But ICBC made a mistake and should acknowledge it. Mistakes happen, fix them.
James B said: "In addition, the story seems to say that ICBC has offered to have an independent valuation of this vehicle done, so it sounds like they are happy to pay fair value." They only offered this after CTV contacted them.
Good on CTV for giving citizens a voice!

Lauire
Agree Wayne - Nanaimo!!

ICBC should be charged under the Criminal Code for many offences. Extortion to injured victims not at fault. They have all the power and are crown corp of thieves and thugs

Laurie
People who are fed up with being held ransom by ICBC and forced, in this world of free enterprise, to have no other choice BUT ICBC, please email Premier Campbell at "premier@gov.bc.ca" and tell thim to let his people go!!!!!!

Ken
ICBC is gouging British Columbians!
Based on the comments here ICBC has committed criminal fraud at least 3 documented times have they ever been charged?
Just moved back from WA State my insurance there was $1060/yr same exact coverage here is $2400/yr. That's with 8 yrs clean driving record and maximum discounts.
Even adjusting for currency exchange it's a 40% increase!

icbc is full of crooks
my damage wasn't replaced, just repaired yet the bodyshop had me sign a waiver that the bumper was replaced before i could get my car back!

icbc and all of it's shops are rotten to the core, didn't we all jut see this a few years back with the management? government will never change unless we the voters cause it to change!

Concerned Canadian
Speaking of discrimination- does ICBC still charge more to young male drivers than to young female drivers? This is gender discrimination- shouldn't they be charged under the human rights code- or does only apply when female ski jumpers are offended? Why do equal rights laws only help women? It's true that as a group young males have more accidents- but charging every young man more is gender stereotyping, isn't it? Where are all of the feminist defenders of equal rights?

james who works for icbc aproved repair shop
this car was involved in an accident. i've fixed cars in far worst shape than this one and they are on the road today. the fact that icbc sold this car without the owners' consent is criminal.
they offered them a settlement on the car the kid spent 2700 on motor 1000 for rims and tires, and if you watch the story them parts were the parts missing from the car.
I deal with scrapyards on a daily basis and them parts are not cheap -- the kid should have had the option on selling the parts himself.
icbc stole that kid's car and sold it just like a chop shop would you buy insurance from icbc you dont buy cars from icbc not in less you work for icbc and want to make money off someones car you write off.

rose
Harry...more people do come forward but the media ignores them! 19 year olds dumping money into a car and then losing out makes a good story, a family car with no extra investments into it doesn't!

My son's car was recently stolen, was recovered the following day,and ICBC said it would be crushed within 3 weeks because of "high milage" and they "wouldn't know if the theif had caused damage by driving erratically".

My son wanted his car back! "Absolutely not, it will be crushed!", he was told.

Hmm...2 DAYS later he sees an identical car for sale, checks it out, checks the VIN number, and guess what?? Yup, it's his car alright! So much for the Car will be crushed within 3 weeks!!

They went back to ICBC but got nowhere, and the car disappeared from where it had been sitting!

I'm sure many have been satisfied with how ICBC dealt with them, but how many have of them have just trusted that what ICBC said was the truth.

ICBC=S.O.L.
The point isn't what he was going to get for the car. the point is he put money into the car and he didn't have a choice to get the money back out before it was taken. He then was low balled.

a similar thing happened to me. I was rear ended and the car was deemed a write off unsalvagable. Fortunately, I bought the car back and stripped the parts out of it.
ICBC wanted to give me 12,000$ for the Honda Del sol.
I stripped my "3000$" engine and a bunch of other odd parts I added and the end figure I got from selling everything was closer to "18,000$"
maybe he would not have gotten as good outlook as me but the point is he lost that choice.

Charlie Flynn
ICBC Nepotism and patronage is what socialist policies supplant for a competitive based private company. ICBC takes the "Beautiful" out of British Columbia lifestyle. The worse corporation in the history of Canada, dealing in intimidation, extortion and criminal tactics to avoid disappointing their all important political masters, led by the Corrupter in Chief Campbell. It is wrong and against every tenet of the rule of law and our Charter of Rights, but no lawyer in BC dares challenge them.